Friday, March 8, 2013

Official Response

Mr. Mohammad, thank you for thoughts, I know you believe Islam is true, and obviously, I do not. We are at an impasse, this is where your burden of proof comes in. In my previous blog post, I included a nice video explaining what burden of proof is and why we need it, please check that out here.

As a form of evidence you sent me the video I linked to before, and the first thing I will point out is that there is no need to go through the web of dishonesty in the video, but to point out some very simple mistakes which have been repeated.

Before getting into the thick of it, however, I want to mention that I am not sure you care to learn about this. Back in Kuala Lumpur, you mentioned "proof" of the prophet's miracles by citing  a NASA photograph from a Muslim creationist website. I added the Wikipedia article above. At the time I pointed you to another website which debunked that claim, as well as clear and precise quotes from astronomers, astrophysicists, and more importantly, from NASA itself,


"My recommendation is to not believe everything you read on the internet. Peer-reviewed papers are the only scientifically valid sources of information out there. No current scientific evidence reports that the Moon was split into two (or more) parts and then reassembled at any point in the past."
Brad Bailey
NLSI Staff Scientist
Yes, that is NASA Lunar Science Institution.  Now, in your recent email to me, you once again bring up a very specific point which I clearly remember getting you to admit was wrong! My concern is that despite finding your evidence to not be correct, you went back to it as truth once again. This is intellectually dishonest.

You said:


I do believe in our Quran religion, which has been by written by an illiterate man before 1434 years ago, and which describes things happening today or happened before his birth and after his death. All and each word in our Quran came from our creator but not from our Prophet, and he declares it clearly that whatever I tell you has been summoned on me.In his days he told us scientific proves seen by your NASA guys today, which our prophet couldn't see or judge it during his lifetime, and ironically you want me to believe in books written by some drunken materialistic guys who just want to sell their idea to others like you. 

It is explicitly clear to me that you are not interested in hearing an opinion from someone who is a materialist, which constitutes the majority of all scientists. By closing yourself off to only certain information, you are committing a confirmation bias.

Now back to what the NASA representative said, that "Peer-reviewed papers are the only scientifically valid sources of information out there." This is a very powerful statement, and it is clearly misunderstood by the video. Science is not something a scientist puts together by him/herself, science is the checking and rechecking of data and hypothesis against natural measurements by making falsifiable predictions.

Throughout the video, there were massive claims made with little to no evidence, such as "the project is literally the secularization of the world, to completely strip the world of religious beliefs, that is why it is called (The New World Order)"

Besides being classic conspiracy nonsense, these claims are made with an uncomfortable amount of certainty. Don't forget, with extraordinary claims, you need extraordinary evidence, and all I see are people who drastically misunderstand what it means to be secular. Now it is funny you live in a Muslim majority region of the world, and secularism is considered an evil intrusion. Well, for many Muslims living in the USA, as well as Sikhs, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists and others, the concept of secularism is a precious idea, as it protects them from the majority of Christians, who have been known in the past to force their beliefs on others through the school systems, the courts, or the law.

Secularism is not any attempt to remove religion, but an effort to make sure that the particular religion people personally believe in is their personal choice, not forcing it on others, including their children. Secularism is vital for any application of Human Rights, something many Muslim countries are notorious for ignoring or forgetting.

For the rest of the video, this will be very easy:

The Multiverse hypothesis is not supported by much evidence, and is highly controversial even among those who advocate it. The video makes it sound like all scientists are certain about this. This is the other primary difference between science and faith. There are a lot of really cool questions out there, some for answers we may never get. The only way to proceed though, is through doubt and skepticism, not by attributing what we don't understand to a god, which does not explain anything at all!

YES, if someone says a god created something you must ask where did the god come from, and simply by saying that there is this one idea which doesn't need to come from anything, that a god always existed, then shall we skip a step and simply say the universe always existed? You see, god is not needed in this argument.

Uhhh, Fine Tuning again? When will this argument die? This has been debunked over and over again. Believing the universe is fine tuned for us is like a puddle in the street admiring how neatly the potholes were designed for precisely it's shape. I would highly suggest this book to you, by Victor Stenger, an actual physicist, but he is one of those "materialists" you mentioned. Thus I will send you a YouTube link as well!
Fine Tuning is done, sorry.

Lastly, Evolution is a fact. In everyday language we accept Neo-Darwinian Evolution as as much of a fact as gravity (which is also a theory!), or the planets going around the Sun (also a theory!). You will not get away with trying to refute evolution. As I quoted above, the only thing we need to look at is Peer-Reviewed Scientific literature, and even then be skeptical. The men you have speaking in your videos (I rarely see creationist women debating these things), are not peer-reviewed scientists. They are discredited kooks who are financed by creationist organizations. The apologist William Lane Craig was featured many times, a man who took Kalam's cosmological argument to be proof of the Christian god. This is a man who justifies the biblical slaughter of the Canaanite people, every man, woman and child, on the grounds that they were "corrupt and deserving of punishment". Sounds like a pretty damn good reason for secularism.

As I previously explained, even if you could somehow show evolution to be false, you would still not be any closer to demonstrating that your god or your religion was correct.

So no, no denying evolution unless you are a biologist submitting a peer-reviewed scientific paper because it is absolutely clear to me you do not understand biology if the video makes sense to you. Try reading this, this, or this book for a better description of how biology and evolution works.

So, we are back to an impasse, and the default decision: Non-belief, becomes the one we will accept until there is a good reason to believe in any of the claims.

Suggestion -- start small, make a simple claim and try to demonstrate it is true before throwing out other claims. We can make progress this way. Good luck, Mohammad, I hope to hear from you.




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